Season 3, Episode #6: Building a Values-Driven Agency and Supporting Sustainable Brands with Andrea Henao of 360 Agency Berlin

[INTRO]
[0:00:05.8] ANNOUNCER: Welcome back to Happy Porch Radio. The podcast for progressive
agency owners and web professionals. Season three is focused on the growing number of
agencies who are making the world a better place.
We explore what this even means, why is it different from any other agency and how can it be
reconciled with the real-world challenges of running a profitable agency? Join your host, Barry
O’Kane as he speaks to leaders of agencies who are driven by verify use to positively impact
the world around them.
[INTRODUCTION]
[0:00:43.8] BOK: 360 Berlin is an integrated advertising agency who, as well as their expertise
in advertising, are driven by their values. This means they work exclusively with sustainable
brands and in this interview the founder, Andrea, shares what led her and her partners to
founding the agency, about how vital their values are to the agency and how strong a stance
they take. For example, she describes her, the vetting process they use to select the clients that
they work with.
As well as talking openly and honestly about how their impact is at least as important as their
financial success of the agency, she also shares how those values drive them to take
responsibility for a wider conversation in the industry, which in turn has led to becoming involved
in EU initiatives around protecting online buyer’s privacy and supplier workshops in developing
countries, all of which makes a much cooler portfolio than your standard ad agency.
So I hope you find this interview as inspiring as I did.
[INTERVIEW]
[0:01:47.0] AH: How we founded this agency, then I’ve been first working on the creative side in
Paris, for built [0:01:54.4 inaudible]. Then, I joined the strategic media planning side in London
for different accounts such as LG and Philips. Very quickly, I realized that it didn’t make any
sense to have such a huge division between the media side and the creative side.
It did make sense to have such a big division I would say 20 years ago when the TV spans and
the media plan worked so high. But the thing is, nowadays online is taking a much more
proportion of the [inaudible] of any campaign and I’ve been able, in the different accounts to
negotiation more and more added value which could not only benefit the media side but also the
creative side.
Then I have two colleagues that I was working with that we were entirely agreeing with that
insights and we really strongly thought that first of all, we were lacking of having a very
streamlined information between the two sides, the creative and the media site and probably, as
you know, when you have two different agencies, even with the client we of course the two
sides to work together, it doesn’t always happen. That the first thing.
The second thing is we could make more savings by having these two sides [inaudible] and the
last thing, which is a very important thing as well, is that we were doing a strategy on the media
side but the creative side was doing also in many accounts that they were working on, another
strategy for the creative side. But the thing is it would make much more sense to work strongly
together on the same brief, on the strategy as well and this happened specifically on the
Volkswagen account that the client was physically asking us on the creative and the media side
to work together but it didn’t always happen with all the agencies.
Then, we really had the urge with the other partners to start creating this agency. Then this is
the first really rational that we had. The second one that we had was that after working on so
many different account such as LG, Philips Heineken and Volkswagen, which was an amazing
experience. I was thinking, “Now if I need to take another step, a new step, I would like to work
for something that I really truly believe in and I think if we take into consideration the era we are
living in, just to promote a product without even knowing what we are promoting or having to
agree on what we promote, make us responsible on the message we actually deliver.”
I was thinking, “This is quite unfair. I would like to strongly promote and work for when I truly
believe.: This was a true main, which you know, which we had when we created with 60 Agency
Berlin, which was to be innovative for the industry.
[0:05:05.5] BOK: Yeah, I was just going to say, that’s quite a – So the combining of the media
and the creative side, the buying the creative side is something I think is more common or as
people looking at more integrated approaches or different approaches more common now than
in the past. But then also, looking at it from your, I guess, values like you said really, it’s brands
and campaigns and things that you really personally connect to.
Was that difficult, was that challenging to do that at the early days of setting up the agency?
[0:05:32.5] AH: It was for many reasons. The first one is on a global level, because we have not
only 360 Agency Berlin but now we have 360 Agency Americas and 360 Agency Europe as well.
Then, at the time when we created the agency, you didn’t have a global agency, which is truly
[inaudible] the two disciplines of media and creative.
To give you an example, Mindshare or MediaCom who are huge media companies have a
leader sisters, such as [inaudible], for example. In each advertising group, you will see that most
of the time, there is a media entity and another big creative one. Then, it was not only
challenging but it was not [inaudible] and then in this sense, it was definitely a challenge.
[0:06:23.1] BOK: Yeah. Tell me if you don’t mind a little bit about your – the process of where
your fellow founders when you said, “Okay, we’re going to start an agency, we’re going to have
this identity and we’re going to work — we want to work with these types of brands.” What were
the steps, what was that journey like?
[0:06:41.3] AH: The journey was actually easier than what we found that what we could expect.
Then we created the Agency in Germany and it was – it’s actually unbelievable how easy the
process is. Like most, the most legitimate company or I would say, the more important stages,
it’s a GMBH. GMBH is actually quite easy to found here in Germany.
You just need founds, basically. A notary and the content. Then, it was easier than what has
been that process if we would have formed it in French. In comparison as well, it has been
much easier to found it in Germany, Berlin if we take into consideration our principles as if we
would have founded it in London.
This is why actually we called it 360 Agency Berlin at the start because Berlin is really a very
progressive city. A lot of people are turning towards sustainability, ethical products and brands.
Then it was, I would say, very warmly welcomed to open this agency in Berlin. We even had
some help from people, from the government, trying to help us on how we could maneuver. We
would have done that in London, I think people would have laughed at us. Then in that sense, it
was much easier and to do it in Germany.
[0:08:21.0] BOK: That’s really interesting. You think, is that something that’s unique to the
environment you’re describing in Berlin or in Germany there or is that something that you’ve
seen in other places now that you’re growing the agency?
[0:08:32.8] AH: I think with the conditions of today, what’s happening, the conjuncture of the
climate today, I think more and more countries and more and more people are massively
concerned and are agreeing with these principles. I think it’s something, it’s in the interest of
everyone, you know? To start really looking on what is behind the chains of prediction and what
is the real impact on the environment of the brands we promote, produce. You know?
I think it’s – we are all responsible for what’s happening. I think this is really the starting point of
our decision in funding this agency and I think it’s not only in Berlin, of course in Berlin it’s big,
it’s huge and you can feel that people are extremely politically engaged. It can be for croissant,
for cake or for buying a car. There is a massive consumer joining before actually an actual
purchase. But I think it’s not only something which it’s basically for Germany or Berlin. I think it’s
definitely increasing in the entire world.
Actually, there is a survey which has been done recently by Neilson, the research house, which
are so proving that more and more people get truly interested and concerned by what is the
impact on the environment and social as well.
[0:10:02.6] BOK: Yes, I think that’s very true, I’ve observed the same trend. Another thing I’m
interested in there is that we could hear the passion in your voice when you talk ab out that and
the principles and the things that you care about and I guess the reason that you wanted to start
the agency in this way.
Is that something you find difficult to explain to potential clients? Do you find that having, “this is
who we are, this is the type of projects and clients we want to work with,” is that a difficult
conversation or do you find it’s easy the other way and clients come looking for companies like
yourselves that have matching values?
[0:10:34.3] AH: Then the new business managers who work in the agency find it much easier
than working for other brands and other agencies and defending the pitch. I find it – I don’t know
if it’s easier but people are much more involved and the budgets are not the same, I have to say,
to be honest but the people we work with are most of the time, extremely engaged in what we
do.
Then, yeah, I wouldn’t say it’s facilitates a conversation but I would say the people we talk with
are definitely more motivated and more engaged to make it happen.
[0:11:18.4] BOK: Yeah, I can totally see that. I assume as well that on your team, as you’ve
grow on your team and the new business managers, that’s something that they care about as
well. So it’s easier to keep your team engaged with that? Is it irrelevant or is it easier to keep the
team engaged if you have that joint values?
[0:11:36.6] AH: That’s a very good question. I would say so but at the same time, that’s really
not anything you need to have a good team sticking together. I think we are very lucky to have
the people we have on board and it certainly facilitates to have people who have the same
motivation and the same principle and values.
But I think it’s maybe we tend to really do a lot of things together and to build a lot of projects
together as well. Like to give you an example, the new business managers are often, as well in
the meetings when we discuss about creativity. We never took back the decisions, only the
partners or the creative together. It’s really a conversation that most of the time we get of course
the different people who work at the agency.
First of all, it really enriched the conversation and the ideas that we can have. I think it’s much
more valuable as well, and they feel more valuable as well. Then I think it’s a different way to
work as well which get them very involved. Not only the values because, you know, if you only
have values that not anything in the back to really backup your ideas and to make them alive on
a daily basis, then people don’t stick awhile as much as the people we’ve been working with,
who joined at the start of the agency and that we keep working with now.
[0:13:09.4] BOK: Yeah. Does the same thing apply with clients as well? If you have this sort of
joint values, do you have build ongoing relationships beyond specific projects or?
[0:13:21.3] AH: Yes, definitely. Because in fact, we don’t use the same ways to be enumerated.
To give you an example, for [inaudible], we truly believed in her brand and we offer to be –
because she didn’t have a very big budget at the start. Then we proposed to be paid on the prorata
on the incremental increase of her safe. Which was a massive help for her.
We still have a very strong relationship and we still work together. Then yes, it’s definitely, it’s
even stronger for the clients we work with. Plus, for us, it’s extremely important to have them
happy because I don’t know how to explain but that’s the best way to advocate other brands as
well who would join in the future and I don’t know? I think it’s because we believe so much in
what we do that it enable us to be very motivated on what we work on and find different ideas I
would say and things which really fit to their brand image. I don’t know, for the moment, yeah, I
would say, it creatives an even stronger agency brand relationship.
[0:14:44.4] BOK: How do you compare that to your previous experience before you started this
agency? When we mentioned working on some really great brands and really great projects but
you didn’t feel personally connected, does it feel different now?
[0:14:57.0] AH: I was feeling personally connected on some accounts. It was truly enjoyable to
work on the Volkswagen account and the client was specifically interesting and knowing exactly
what he wanted, which made the work even more interesting. You don’t have the decision, you
know? To say yes or not. When you are – when you have a belief, you have a belief.
You cannot ask questions or you can ask questions but you need to be very careful and in
which question you ask, you know? Because there is 12 other agencies or even more who are
looking for you to use the account. Then you need to be very careful, you always are on very
warm stones, walking on warm stones I would say. Our approach is so different. To give you an
example, there is an article which has been written from a German magazine called Business
Bank and they called the whole article The Berghain Effect. I don’t know if you know that very
well-known club in Berlin called Berghain. Does it ring any bells?
[0:16:03.1] BOK: Yes, I’ve definitely heard the name but that’s as far as much information as I –
[0:16:06.5] AH: Here we go, everyone heard about that name, even if you are not in the
clubbing scene. The thing is, the specificity of that club is extremely hard to enter and then,
that’s a bit the same thing for our agency. We truly select the clients we are working with in
order to really not damage, our image as an agency. Then, it enables us to ask questions before
to actually work with the clients.
When you are deep situation, fighting against 10 other agencies, you are truly not in the same
situation. See what I mean?
[0:16:42.0] BOK: 100%. What kind of process or what kind of questions do you go through
when you’re deciding whether to work with a client or not?
[0:16:50.4] AH: Very good question. There is three of them. The first one is do they have any
CSR terms and policies in place. The first one, as the second one, sorry, it’s what is their impact
on their environment, then what is behind their chains of prediction, where do they produced?
The third one is respect the international labor rights. To be honest with you, most of the time
when they’re producing you up, the third one is valid and completed and it’s more for the second
first — the two first questions that we need to look closely.
It’s more when they produce abroad that we need to really closely look at these three points.
But an idea that we had and we hope to be able to do it in the long term is we would truly would
like to have some audits and audit stricter with these agencies within the few years to be able to
create the parameters to fulfil and to be able to work with us.
We find that the [sustainable label] is not as something we can believe on or I would say, the
sustainable label is what organic our view was 15 years ago. I mean, to give you an example, a
very clear example, H&M had his green label on their dress, which was — and on their T-shirts
as well. In terms of price, you should count three times the normal price, okay? It has that green
label called “Conscious”. It seems entirely sustainable or organic and then – but organic and
sustainable is not the same thing, you know? Organic, it’s like the products that they produce
with and sustainable is all if they compile with all the parameters and environmental but social
as well, which is extremely important for the local population.
Then, you have that very misleading green etiquette. In fact, when we took a look much more in
depth, because we wanted to know more about it and we find a very interesting documentary
made by a French channel, actually review the prediction chains in India, which have a lot of
different localities where they produce. You as the journalist, when — at the end of the day
when the workers finish at like 11 PM when they started at eight or nine AM, then the ask them
to collect the etiquette they working on. And no surprise, you had normal etiquette of H&M but
she has that very precise green etiquette as well.
Then, we contacted, iboycott.org that we work with sometimes and that we have as well in their
launch. Then they contacted H&M and H&M said, “Sorry guys, in fact, it’s green because it’s
produced with view curtain but it’s producing the same conditions to the rest of our staff. Then
you see how a green etiquette, which has a tone of sustainability can be massively misleading
and then I think a lot of – people are not protected against these and the immediate danger is
that people lose faith. Lose faith on buying more expensive to save the planet but finally doesn’t
have any consequence on the prediction.
Then, we think there is a need for a stronger audit. There is great companies doing it, don’t get
me wrong. For example, New Balance, they do some surprise audits in the companies that they
are – they employ in the different countries and that they don’t have the way to change their
process of working wiser audits if you understand what I mean. Then, it’s really important to
straighten the different ways to audit this companies because when and specifically ones that
are void. Because it’s so easy to change documents over there as well. Sometimes there are
very corrupted countries and it’s very important to understand, to give you another example and
the example of B Corp, which is supposed to be a blue label.
The company is who apply to these label, just send documents. But you can falsify so easily
documents in these countries that it’s not enough, you see what I mean? This is why we really
would like in the long term to straighten first of all, the parameters that we agree with the clients
and therefore we really would like to have an audit entity within our agency in the future.
[0:21:49.3] BOK: That’s really interesting and I guess ambitious. A goal as well really powerful.
Does that process at the moment, or like you’re building towards what you're describing there,
does that take a lot of resources, a lot of effort? You know, it must be quite difficult to find clarity
in some of those things at the moment in order to decide whether the client is a good fit or the
project is a good fit for your agency?
[0:22:10.1] AH: That’s a good question. At this stage it doesn’t require so much resources. It
mainly is a business managers who look into details with the partners but it doesn’t require more
resources and things at this stage. We wish that in the future we’ll be able, as I said, to look
much more in depth. But it’s important as well to adapt to the market today. You know it is very
surprising for brands already now to have been asked these questions.
But I hope in five years it is going to be much more accepted and then we can go a bit deeper
into details. It’s very important to know risk as well as the clients and to do things in the right
tempo I would say and in the right manner, adequate manner as well.
[0:22:59.4] BOK: So when you say that sort of maybe they find it surprising or have you found
circumstances where you were working or you were starting to work with brands, are they
defensive or they react negatively to asking those questions?
[0:23:11.2] AH: No, most of the time no but it’s true that I had a few like potential clients that we
didn’t work with in the future I would say, but who are very evasive. Very, very evasive and then
we were asking questions and you could feel that they were feeling more embarrassed than
angry and then looking into details, yeah. No, it would be too much risk for us to lose our
credibility’s and we renounced to work with them. But yeah, I would say more embarrassment
than anger.
[0:23:46.4] BOK: That’s interesting. It’s also interesting that you are conscious very much of
your own, as well as the values but the perception of those values as well. Do you find that you
ever have to make compromises maybe for financial reasons or other reasons or is there…?
[0:23:59.9] AH: No.
[0:24:00.5] BOK: No?
[0:24:01.4] AH: No, so excuse the word. The answer is super easy. No. Actually we work very
closely with the European Commission doing different workshops in the elder seeds and sharing
their GST plus initiative in this countries and we hunt the exact same question from the
European Commission the first time we presented our initiative they were saying, “But how do
you generate money and is it enough?” And then Martin and myself were in the meeting and
they answered, “But when money is enough money?” You know? I think the work we use we
generate are not as big as other agencies but it’s enough I have to say and I think it is better to
work and we live fully to believe in what you do instead of not being sure and lose that
confidence but have a bigger account, I would say. I’d rather it’s the first solution I would say.
[0:25:00.4] BOK: Yeah, I think that makes complete sense and I really like the fact that it was a
very definite very strong answer. Because quite often there is this sort of perception or we are
going to resent a façade, a front to the world saying, “This is our values, this is what we are and
whatever.” But then behind the scenes there is always compromises and it is much more muddy
and much less clear for everybody working here.
[0:25:22.8] AH: Yeah but that is impossible because first of all, that is what they have seen in
the media side. I’m not go into details but there is a lot of things happening on the media side
and things that made me extremely angry and it is impossible for me and for my colleagues to
do the things that we have seen in the past. No way and that’s mainly things that we strongly
fight against and it wouldn’t make sense. I think if you really truly believe in what you do, money
is not enough and enough reason to change your belief, you know?
I know it sounds very idealistic but that is the truth and I guess more and more people feel the
same and we think 10 or I would say 15 years ago, profits was the main parameters that people
were taking into consideration. But I strongly believe that the generation which are coming after
and starting with the millennials then it’s people who really think that there is of course profit
because you need to survive.
But other parameters that you need to take into consideration, such as social impact and impact
on the environments and I think these people are so much exposed to different sources of
information that it’s okay to actually not only have that very, very simple target, which is profit but
to align with order requirements, if it makes sense?
[0:26:58.1] BOK: It makes complete sense. Do you have any formal or do you have any
measurement structures around for within your agency within how you identify or measure those
other values or other things that are important or is it less measurement and more on how you
feel about how you are progressing in those areas?
[0:27:17.9] AH: First of all when you say measurements, do you mean KPI’s?
[0:27:21.5] BOK: Yes, for example KPI’s. My question I think is basically it’s very easy to
measure profit. You know it is a very clear number. Measuring things like the social impact or
the environmental impact or the impact that you are enabling your clients and the brands that
you work with to have, it is much harder to put numbers and actually measurement around that
however form that takes.
[0:27:40.2] AH: Of course, and I have been asked this question once as well and my answer
was, but how do want – it was the brand that we have which creates swimming suits from fillets
in the water, you know? Plastic from the water, from the sea, which is we caught it from the
fillets that the fishes use and then we helped them but the thing is how do you want to measure
like this is such a small effort compared to what can really be done such as extremely hard to
measure our impact.
And yeah, I think it is almost even impossible at this stage and I think as long as we truly help a
change coming and helping to develop these sustainable brands, it’s already a great thing and it
is inspirational for lots of people as well and this is a factor, which is absolutely impossible to
measure but now because measurements is a very good question that now, we work exactly the
same way as another media agency concerning the KPI’s.
[0:28:56.7] BOK: That makes sense. Okay so just to change topics slightly, I am looking
forward to the future of your agency and the way that you’d like to go. What are the challenges
and the opportunities that you are looking at as you look forward into the next year, five to 10
years?
[0:29:12.5] AH: In terms of challenges I think things are not yet to come, let’s see what’s
happened and I think we will tell you but I think we need to adapt ourselves very quickly
because we are progressing in a very fast changing world and I think it’s how we are going to
adapt ourselves in the future, which is going to be the challenge because we need to be always
in that edge in order to really remain there I think because other companies like us are definitely
going to appear I guess.
Even if we are first in the world to do that now, I’m pretty sure and it’s okay. You know, more
people take this turn and they better it is for the planet anyway. We are not going to complain
about that. Then this could be the challenge. Now in terms of opportunities is that more and
more I would say government people are interested with what we do and we are creating
actually there is a conference right now we are having in Berlin in the 19th of October with ARTE
Magazine. I don’t know if you know ARTE Magazine, do you know?
[0:30:21.6] BOK: No, I don’t.
[0:30:22.2] AH: Okay, it’s French-German TV channel called ARTE and they have a magazine
called the ARTE Magazine and very specialized in what is cultural artistic stuff and they are
moderating the conference that we are doing with Kim Buzz in Berlin and we are inviting very
different people or I would say actor of sustainable advertising and this is an opportunity I find
because we just created the event and there is already some people interested and they were
thinking initially that only a few people would be like so some into us but not at all.
It seems like it is really interests people and this is definitely an opportunity because more
people are interested and more, we have the opportunity to do even greater things together I
guess and one of the other opportunities as well is we and this one is probably is the most – as
much as it is an opportunity it’s also a challenge. What we are doing with the world economy for
them, we have been invited. It was November of last year to go in PUXEL, in the European
Commission and discuss with order of specialists about online data privacy.
Which we find is extremely important and it’s part of the system of advertising as well because it
is very important we find to be less intrusive and to avoid certain time of targeting for the users
and then the question was about how the industry can actually improve and it was a very
interesting meeting and then this is definitely an opportunity but a challenge as well to fulfill
there were no more requirements. As much as working in advertising but taking the back of the
online users and really think on where we need to stop and where we need to considerate
online privacy. That’s a privacy.
[0:32:27.6] BOK: To me that is really interesting, there is two things which are I guess a larger
remit than the purely doing the advertising, doing the campaigns, doing the communications and
maybe other stuff. Yeah and is that the sort of thing that comes about because you and the
agency are focused on these broader values do you think? I mean is there a direct connection
between we want to work and do this work because of these values and therefore we are
looking at this broader picture?
[0:32:56.9] AH: Of course and in fact to get back to what we do very quickly and it’s really not to
do like another for our agency but for you to understand clearer what it means sustainable
advertising then first of all, as you really clearly understood and as it’s very simple as well we
promote exclusively sustainable brands but what we do as well, we do some workshops things
[inaudible] in developed countries where we actually explain why is it so important to produce in
a more sustainable way.
And we explain as well that there is an even bigger target than what you can imagine who is
interested by this kind of production in Europe and then we explain as well different techniques
that they can use to promote, which are very cheap because most of the time they have limited
but which are very targeted as well. Then we explain online what it is and different targeting
techniques that we could use and then the last points that we explained is a GST plus initiative,
which is led by the European Commission in which helps to sustainable production from the
LDC to export to Europe for free, that most of the time they do not know about it.
Then it’s really great, a virtuous cycle between advertising, production and exportation in LDC
people who need it then this is what we do as well and the last point, which is very important
and that we take the lead on it’s really to defend online users and that their privacy more than
the actual and useable industry I would say.
And these are really the points we differentiate our self and it came naturally to do these three
things. They are totally implicated. You know if you talk about sustainable advertising, you need
to talk about these different points than thinking something a bit more alter it, thinking about
lands to other countries how we can help with all of that knowledge that we collected for years,
for decades and then I still think of the online consumer which is like bombarding with
advertising now with online, even more than what it was for TV. Then if we are talking about
something fair, it needs to be fair on every level.
[0:35:31.2] BOK: I remember at the start of the conversation you said about taking
responsibility, which I think is really interesting tying to that point there about really
understanding the buyer’s rights and helping defend them at the same time as part of the
industry. Also trying to get them to try to buy the right brands.
[0:35:47.7] AH: Yeah.
[0:35:49.1] BOK: I think that is very interesting. Do you find that the workshops in the LDC, the
work you are doing in LDC and those countries and organizations like that, is that with suppliers
directly who are working with your clients or are you able to — or is it a separate thing entirely?
[0:36:05.1] AH: No, never. No, it is totally separated. First of all, we don’t have any power or
suggestion under at the meetings. They are selected by the chamber of commerce or by the
European Delegation itself. Then we have now supposed to be sustainable but in the chamber
of commerce situations they were not so often or they were not all I’d have to say and in the
case of the European delegation as they were owned but they were very small producers.
But it was amazing because we had the occasion to really be confronted to people who hardly
actually know what online is because you know they don’t have the same online penetration as
what we have not even the same kind of word bound, you know? Then they don’t have the
same usage as us. Then it’s truly fulfilling to help these people to understand how it works and
to give them some clues on how they can improve their business.
You feel that what you do is like 10 times more valuable sometimes but what we can do for no
more clients who are used to it and yeah.
[0:37:24.5] BOK: Yeah, really rewarding then?
[0:37:26.2] AH: Yeah, totally. I would say in a human level at least but in the way of course we
enjoy working in both configurations as much as – yeah, you know, in a human perspective is
really fulfilling I would say.
[0:37:45.2] BOK: And one area that I am personally very interested in here running my own
little agency is the personal journey of going through from founding agency and running and
growing the agency, how much of a rollercoaster has that been? Have you always felt confident
and strong about the agency and how would you maybe speak to other agency owners, other
founders who want to run to work in a way that’s tied closely to their values, what would you say
to them to help support them through that journey?
[0:38:13.0] AH: Well of course we had some doubts. I think it is part of the journey and it is what
makes it interesting as well, you know? Like all of the questions you can have while you doubt
are questions that most of the time you must ask yourself then I would say to that is entire no
more but for certain ones, it is extremely important to make it happen and succeed and I think
one of the order, very important things aren’t to be surrounded with the right people, the people
you can really trust. The right people. Sorry, my “r’s” sometimes is very difficult to pronounce.
With the good people. People you can really trust and can be – who can definitely have a lot of
fantasy and work of course different disciplines as well.
Yeah, I don’t know which kind of advice I could give but yeah, as long as you strongly believe in
what you’re doing and that you accept, question yourself as much as possible in order to
improve because that’s the thing. The thing is, for any agency that the way it works, you need to
always question yourself in order to know how you can do things better because life’s change
extremely quickly and the world we live in then it’s extremely important to always know how to
adapt yourself.
I would say that’s definitely is a true things to remember and keep and definitely one of the most
important as well, it’s to be with the people who help you and that you strongly believe in and
trust because it’s thanks to these people that the agency is still on and even stronger, it’s thanks
to Luc, to Ricky, to Martin, to Alex. Without these people, seriously, it could not have happened
and it’s so important to have these people who share the same ideas, the same energy because
you know, you don’t generate so much revenue at the start. Then you need to have people on
board who really believe in what you’re doing. As long as you have these people on board then
it’s going to be a beautiful journey.
[END OF INTERVIEW]
[0:40:51.7] BOK: You can get all the links and notes from this episode on happyporchradio.com
where you can also find out how to send us questions, feedback and get involved in the
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enjoy it too. Thanks for listening.
[END]